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How to Protect Yourself and Your Company from Cyber Threats with Sean Nobles, President at NaviSec, LLC was automatically transcribed by Sonix with the latest audio-to-text algorithms. This transcript may contain errors. Sonix is the best way to convert your audio to text in 2019.
Welcome to the Outcomes Rocket podcast, where we inspire collaborative thinking, improved outcomes and business success with today’s most successful and inspiring health care leaders and influencers. And now your host, Saul Marquez.
Saul Marquez:
Welcome back to the podcast. Saul Marquez here. Today had the privilege of hosting Sean Nobles. He’s president of Navisec, a Tampa-based company that addresses full-service cybersecurity needs for small to medium sized businesses. Nobles has 20 plus years of cybersecurity experience. His education and certifications include Offensive Security, Certified Professional Master of Business Administration for Fortinet Network Security Expert 4 and Cisco Certified Network Professional. Sean is also a combat veteran of the U.S. Marine Corps. And we thank him for his service. He’s doing outstanding work in the cybersecurity space today. If you’re listening to this, you have a business or you have a need for protecting the hard work that you’ve done. And we’re gonna be diving into some hot topics of cyber-security and giving you a little bit of insight into this area that I think everybody needs to be addressing in their businesses. So, Sean, an incredible pleasure to have you here with us today. Thanks for doing it.
Sean Nobles:
Likewise. Thank you. Saul.
Saul Marquez:
So, Sean, you know, you’ve been in the in the cybersecurity space, but you guys have a niche in health care. Tell me how that happened and why you’ve been able to make such an impact in health care.
Sean Nobles:
Sure. So SMB is in general are pretty underserved when it comes to having access to enterprise class cybersecurity solutions. So for the most part, health care companies have already an I.T. guy or an I.T. girl that’s helping them out with their I.T. and desktop support and things like that. But cybersecurity is very much its own discipline, being able to provide guidance to health care companies in which areas of their infrastructure are most at risk and providing a right sized solution for mitigating the risks is very rewarding. As you know, I have a family and I don’t want their medical records or private information being breached. So I build my solutions for all my clients how I would if they were housing or protecting my own family’s information.
Saul Marquez:
Yeah, that’s key, you know. And so there’s a lot of information that people want. And health care has become a target for hackers and people wanting to steal information. It’s important that we consider it. And then even from the med device face, right, we’ve discussed the impacts of cybersecurity on devices, right, people hacking into devices. It’s real. It’s happening. And I love to hear what you think is a hot topic that the listeners tuning in today, Sean, should be thinking about cybersecurity.
Sean Nobles:
Absolutely. So it’s our mission to see that health care companies have basic cybersecurity in place. It’s 2019 continue to talk to clients and potential clients that aren’t segmenting their networks from other tenants or other building tenants. They don’t have a firewall. They’ve never completed a vulnerability assessment or a pen test. And these are generally basic findings on a HIPAA gap assessment that many companies simply aren’t aware that they need to do. So that’s one of the things that we like to help out with is just we don’t try to do anything to advance the bleeding edge with machine learning and artificial intelligence and things like that. We’re focused primarily on the healthcare space, especially getting just basic cybersecurity in place.
Saul Marquez:
The blocking and tackling.
Sean Nobles:
That’s right. Yep. A lot of the attackers out there, they’re just automated scans that are running on the Internet all the time. And just with how connected our world is, someone could be sitting in Thailand and they could be attacking a small healthcare company in Mississippi, for example.
Saul Marquez:
So what’s one of the common mistakes that people make, Sean, and what’s one of the common open doors to invite these types of things that people don’t even know about?
Sean Nobles:
The big thing is just the user education. I would say so just understanding that what the risk really is out there. And unfortunately, one of the biggest blockers that I get when I’m talking to health care companies are, you know, along the lines of, well, we’ve been in business for 20 years and we haven’t been hacked yet. And I totally get the perspective and the viewpoint there. But it’s only getting worse with ransomware and the automated threats that are out there and these big vulnerabilities that end up in the news all the time. So I’d say in general, the biggest mistake is just not understanding what the real risk is that’s out there.
Saul Marquez:
And so at what point do people need to start thinking about cybersecurity protection? How big a business has to have to be?
Sean Nobles:
That’s a great question. Of course, you know, the answer that I want to say is, you know, day one, you want to start incorporating how you’re going to do cybersecurity and how you’re going to build out your infrastructure in a secure way. But as a business owner, I get that it’s not realistic to think that way. A lot of times there’s two ways that we approach how we do our cybersecurity solutions. And a lot of times we just ask our clients as we’re starting the the relationship. Are you more concerned about a breach and a real cybersecurity event or are you more concerned about meeting gaps in compliance? Because the answer there could be two different things in some cases. It all depends where it companies at in their cybersecurity journey. And definitely from our side, we work with our clients to understand, you know, if you’re having a HIPAA assessment or a security audit of some sort in six months, then we may want to address that first. And we look at the very basics. Are the basics in place that are going to get you through that HIPAA assessment? On the other side of the coin, if they’ve already had an assessment done, of course, they’ve got a nice sheet of paper that says these are the gaps that we found and we work with our clients on how to close those gaps.
Saul Marquez:
Love it. Yeah, it’s good to know the two sides of the coin for that. And yeah, I mean, you know, I think about the basics and you know, if you have a service that has HIPAA requirements, get that done, find a way to do it. I mean, you don’t have to do it all. And that’s why there’s companies like Sean’s to help you get that done. And then on the other side of it is you have a lot of data and you want to protect it. Cybersecurity is an actual threat. Get it done. And I think we always learn more from stories. Shawn, I’d love to hear a story of a client that you’ve helped, how you’ve created results for them through the work that you do.
Sean Nobles:
Sure. So I’ve got several stories where we’ve made a clear impact to our clients. And the first one that comes to mind is we have a client that we’ve detected and offered recommendations in remediation assistance on. There’s over 11000 vulnerabilities in the last year. People’s first response is, wow, that company has a lot of vulnerabilities. They must be doing something wrong. But there’s a lot more to unpackaged to that than just 11000 vulnerabilities were detected. And it’s not uncommon for our first assessments to have hundreds or thousands of findings depending on the size of the organization, knowing the vulnerabilities are there and having the recommendations that we put in place for our clients or make to close those vulnerabilities is one of the basic cyber security services that I’m talking about, a vulnerability assessment. And if you don’t know what vulnerabilities are in your environment, you can’t fix them. So if you have a company that didn’t do a vulnerability assessment, they would have 11000 unaddressed vulnerabilities in their environment and not know about them. So I would say a big recent when a virus is just given this health care company, the ability to identify and fix those vulnerabilities, which makes their entire organization more secure and then their clients information more secure.
Saul Marquez:
So now that they have become aware to those vulnerabilities, what’s next?
Sean Nobles:
Well, just working through the best way to address those vulnerabilities. So in some cases, like a good example I like to use is there can be like a hundred thousand dollar piece of equipment, like a plotter printer or a T-shirt printer or something like that that a company has invested a lot of money in. When we do a vulnerability assessment, we might find that that device is 10 years old. There’s no updates for that device, for firmware or whatever vulnerabilities might exist on it. But what we can do is we can address that and say, OK, well, it’s not practical to just get rid of that device and buy a new one. So what we might do is segment that on its own network and limit the access to that device so it mitigates the risk. Understanding the business case that they have to have that piece of equipment that’s important to their business. And I’d imagine the same could be true with any kind of network connected pharmaceutical manufacturing equipment and other specialized equipment like that. So we don’t just take the approach to say this is vulnerable, we need to get it off the network. We take the approach to say that we understand that the business needs that device, but let’s make it more secure.
Saul Marquez:
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And, you know, I’ve seen an increase interest in at least like providers, hospitals and how they manage their devices with regard to cybersecurity. This has been an area of increased interest. So these devices that are sitting at hospitals, I guess they could be hacked. And then through those devices, if they’re connected to the network, the hacker could access a network through them. Help me understand that better.
Sean Nobles:
Sure. So what typically happens is you have developers and a medical research company or medical manufacturing company. And instead of writing all of the software for that equipment from the ground up, they may incorporate other pieces of software that exist out there. So they don’t have to rewrite a web server or a client server type of application. They rely on libraries and programs that are already out there. And that’s a good and bad thing. What tends to happen from the bad side is they may incorporate a web server or a server type program that it’s secure at the time when they integrated into their product. But maybe there’s a vulnerability that was discovered in that particular version that they incorporated in the equipment and they haven’t gone back or there’s not sufficient tracking to know that that vulnerability now exists in the device, not through anything that the developer did in his code, but because or her code. But or they might be including that vulnerability from someone else’s product that they’ve integrated or solution that they’ve integrated into the product. So when we talk about vulnerability assessments, the medical device, any medical device is similar in nature to workstations and servers that we do vulnerability assessment on because they’re running the same type of embedded Linux or embedded operating systems that inherently have those vulnerabilities, just like a workstation or a server.
Saul Marquez:
So then what happens? Can somebody access the network through a device?
Sean Nobles:
Potentially. So it all depends on the nature of the vulnerability. And as you can imagine, there’s a scale of vulnerabilities where one maybe information disclosure. So maybe there’s a way to use Bluetooth to get someone’s pulse or something, for example, which is protected health care information. But it may not be as bad as if a vulnerability existed and you’re able to manipulate the way that a pacemaker maker works. So you’re talking about information exposure versus actually interfering with the device. Exactly.
Saul Marquez:
Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. I mean, it’s a complicated space, but definitely one that requires attention and protection. The other thing is like ransomware, you know, the ransom, whereas I couldn’t believe it when I first found out about it. And it’s basically when people hijack your files and make you pay to get access to them, right?
Sean Nobles:
That’s right. Ransomware is a tough one because it enters the network either through emails or USB drive or if someone brings a laptop that’s already infected and they’re not, bring your own device scenario and they plug it into your business network. Those are all ways that ransomware can get into your environment. Those are just a few of the many ways it can get in. And once it gets in, each of these ransomware programs are set up differently. So they may go out and look for network shares and start encrypting information on network shares. They may capture usernames and passwords that are being typed through keyloggers that are included in it. The end of the day, what makes ransomware ransomware is it encrypts your files and in some cases it can be customer databases, patient information, things of that nature. And it presents a screen that says go to this Web site and send us bitcoin or some sort of cryptocurrency and then we’ll unlock your files. One of the things I like to talk to my clients about is we never recommend that you pay that ransom. But if you have no other choice at all, it might be something I’d never like to recommend it. But there’s no help desk for these criminals out there that if your files don’t get unencrypted, they’re going to walk you through and help you decrypt them. So that should be the absolute last resort. And when it comes to ransomware, prevention is really the only effective solution for ransomware. One of the first services that we offered was we would respond to ransomware and decrypt the files. And that was back in 2016 or 2017. We stopped doing that because the ransomware has gotten so advanced that all of the methods that we used, like the encryption key being stored in the memory or volume shadow copy, like basically backups that are on the computer, you could go back in and pull the files from there. All of those methods no longer work. And really, we’re just looking it again goes back to basic cybersecurity with a banded firewall and incident handling and response and next generation antivirus, whether it’s ours or someone else’s. It’s just the basics that you need to protect yourself.
Saul Marquez:
Oh, man, that’s crazy. It’s unbelievable the lengths that some of these criminals will go to try to to get money from you or even just to sabotage you. It’s not worth the risk. And I’m glad we’re chatting with Shawn here about some of the best practices. Give us an example of a setback that you guys have had, what you learned from it.
Sean Nobles:
Sure. So ultimately, I gauge the success of our team by the fact that we haven’t had any of our clients that have had breaches or cybersecurity incidents that directly affected their business with a service that we offer. So that’s pretty positive for us in those regards. We haven’t failed our customers, I would say, in that way. But our biggest failure is probably just not being able to communicate some of these highly technical cybersecurity issues that we deal with to the point where whether it’s us or someone else that they end up going with at the end of the day, just getting them to understand the real business risks that are out there. And it’s it’s a fine line to walk because it’s very scary out there on the Internet. There’s just there’s a lot of bad things out there. On the other hand, we don’t want to use fear as the tactic to get people to do it, but we want to educate. And that’s where I think maybe we could find some different ways. It’s a challenge that I took on to do better for the remainder of 2019 and going into 2020 to come up with some presentations or some ways of explaining, you know, just how bad the risk is out there. So that’s definitely something I could do some more work on to to be successful.
Saul Marquez:
Now I love it, Sean, and obviously that’s the reason why you’re here today sharing your message with with the listeners.
Sean Nobles:
Absolutely.
Saul Marquez:
So what’s one of the proudest things you’ve ever done in cybersecurity?
Sean Nobles:
Sure. So there’s several. So penetration testing is another service that that’s offered that we offer and needs to be done for most mature healthcare and other organizations, and it’s not necessarily the first thing that you do. It’s still considered a basic, I would say, but it wouldn’t be the first basic that you address. So what a penetration test is, is where a human, the hacker ethical hacker tries to gain access to an organization. We follow a standard methodology called the PITA Standard. And our typical approach, depending on the size of the organization, is about a two week penetration test that we offer. So we start off doing open source intelligence gathering. And what that is is where we basically we start with the IP addresses, domain name, the name of the company, and we’ll look to see what publicly available information that anyone or any hacker has access to and refer to that as a blackbox penetration test, because we don’t have any internal knowledge of anything that’s going on in the organization. So just one quick anecdote on that. We were able to find on the dark web that one of our clients that’s a large, pretty well-known health care client. They had their Twitter log in like their marketing company name just right on Twitter was. It wasn’t even for sale on the dark web. It was just listed on the dark web. So I was able to get that and get access to the account, added it as a finding to our report. And when I was explaining to them this, is that what we were able to go out and find using open source intelligence, we found this information on the dark web. Their first response was, well, we don’t use that Twitter account anymore. So we don’t really think it’s an important finding. So leveraging the user education, you know, just talking through the the scenario with with the client, I asked them, well, what if one of your competitors or somebody that wanted to do damage to you got access to that? I didn’t pay for it. I didn’t use any special skills other than searching the dark web to find that. But what if somebody that wanted to damage your reputation got on there, made a posting from your official Twitter account and said, we’re going out of business, please give all your business to and name their biggest competitor and framing it like that, we were able to…
Saul Marquez:
So. Sean, I want to understand this better. So in this particular scenario, you went to the dark web and they were offering this Twitter account with a password and everything for sale.
Sean Nobles:
That’s right.
Saul Marquez:
OK. Gotcha. Gotcha. And so then anybody that bought that could then put things out there on their behalf and make them look bad.
Sean Nobles:
Yes. Important distinction there, is it there was no dollar value associated with it. So the password and username was just out there. So anyone I could walk you through in five minutes how to find it since change the password, but that’s the impact. Is anyone especially a targeted if someone’s targeting your business? There’s all this information that’s available on the dark web. And it’s one of the first steps we do and we include in our findings is these employees or your domain was associated with these passwords that are out there that anyone can have access to.
Saul Marquez:
Oh, man, that’s scary. So the dark web, I’ve seen documentaries and like read a little bit about it, but it seems really, really interesting. My understanding is that the dark web or maybe is there a difference between the dark web and the deep web?
Sean Nobles:
Well, I think it’s mostly related to kind of the same. And so when they’re talking about that, it’s an Internet that lives inside the Internet. You need special access and special software. It’s free. You could again, I could show you in five minutes out how to go out and get that. But you can’t just get to it in your web browser directly. There’s additional steps you have to do. And that’s what makes it so dangerous, is it’s hiding kind of under the public facade of the Internet.
Saul Marquez:
Wow, do you spend much time on there?
Sean Nobles:
Not particularly. So the only function really that I have for it is to protect our clients.
Saul Marquez:
Yeah. So you go on there to do scans on their behalf to make sure that there’s no vulnerability.
Sean Nobles:
Or any information for sale. There’s marketplaces. I mean, imagine it’s literally the black market where someone can go out there and say, I will pay twenty thousand dollars if someone’s able to get patient records for this company, for example. So part of our penetration testing, vulnerability assessments, the services that we offer is to go out and see if anyone is actively trying to get information or more importantly, if there’s already information that’s out there, there’s these marketplaces.
Saul Marquez:
Wow. That’s so interesting. It would be interesting to maybe do something where we could show the listeners what that looks like and what types of things are out there. I don’t know if that be something you want to do one of these days, Sean. And then we share it with the listeners.
Sean Nobles:
We absolutely could. And it’s really it’s. It’s just Web sites. And for the most part, there’s forums. And it’s mostly just, you know, people posting on there about can somebody get this? There’s credit card markets. There’s drug markets. It’s been in the news before where someone that ran like this Silk Road, if you remember now reading about that, that was on the dark web or one of the dark webs that are out there and there’s these people that they start communities and it’s like eBay, like a black market eBay definitely demonstrate it. But from a value standpoint, it’s good to know that it’s there and it’s good to know that companies like ours are out there and taking a look at to make sure Right. that that information is not out there. So that’s what I mean. I don’t I don’t have any real purpose to go on.
Saul Marquez:
And no, I totally get that man. But I think there’s a lot of curiosity about that. You know, and so maybe you and I can chat about that after the podcast than think about what that looks like for the listeners, because I think people might be interested. But the point here, being guys and gals, is, look, Sean and his company are looking at these things and they’re spending the time to protect us from the people that want to mess with our files, that want to hack into our servers. They want to do us wrong. And it’s important to have experts taking a look at that. And sometimes you can’t afford to get one of these people full time as an employee. And that’s why they do what they do. Right. You hire them to do the work without having to have a full time person. Sean, in your perspective, what would you say is the most important and exciting project you’re working on today?
Sean Nobles:
Sure. So I’m very excited to start working with there’s a vendor out there called CrowdStrike and they’re offering in particular is. It’s really zero to 80 percent cyber security overnight. I really like the product and the service that we’ve built around it. That’s so CrowdStrike just went public maybe eight weeks ago and had a big, huge IPO. They’ve been around since, I believe, 2011. They’ve built their own threat intelligence and things like that to make their product very effective. So what it is, is it’s the next generation firewall. So next generation antivirus. What sets it apart from legacy antivirus is I’m sure you remember there’s scans that run all the time and your antivirus is scanning through all your files. And that’s very resource intensive, as has to look through every file for a file signature.
Saul Marquez:
Right.
Sean Nobles:
What makes CrowdStrike next generation is. It lives in the memory. It’s running all the time and it’s looking at the processes that are running on your computer. And how I like to explain how it works is if there’s a human that’s looking at all the processes running on your computer and you see a process that or a program that starts indexing all the files on the hard drive and then it’s deleting the backups of those files from your hard drive, and then it’s loading encryption keys into memory and then it starts encrypting files on your hard drive. A human would be able to say something’s not right here that shouldn’t be running. And that’s what CrowdStrike does, is it’s looking at the process. So it’s much more efficient and effective on system resources and things like that, because it doesn’t have to scan all the time and it catches born because it’s looking at the behavior. It’s not just looking at the file signatures. So what makes it very exciting for me is we were the first or one of the first small MSSPs that CrowdStrike allowed to partner with them.
Saul Marquez:
And what’s MSSP, sorry, I just want to make sure I get the acronyms here.
Sean Nobles:
Oh, sure, sure. It’s a managed security service provider.
Saul Marquez:
Got it.
Sean Nobles:
So it’s different than an MSP, which is a managed service provider, which is traditionally desktop support, workstation servers, printers, things like that. We’re strictly security.
Saul Marquez:
Distinction. Thank you for that. Absolutely.
Sean Nobles:
So CrowdStrike is why we’re excited about it is they were focused on like landing ten thousand points, one hundred and points and they were only looking at large companies. And it’s very good technology that I’ve been excited about for a while. And we were trying to partner with them for nine to 12 months and finally, just through persistence and reaching out. They had hired somebody that was going to focus on MSSPs specifically in smaller MSSPs specifically. And we were signed on as a partner. I think it’s third day working with CrowdStrike. So.
Saul Marquez:
Congratulations.
Sean Nobles:
Yeah. Yeah. So just being able to deliver. It’s been a message that we’ve had all along delivering enterprise class security to small and medium health care and other companies. And we’ve been pretty effective at that. And we’re already seeing that it’s been very effective in preventing ransomware. We respond to the detections. So it’s not just you’re not just on your own with an antivirus software like traditionally. Now it’s we’re giving you incident handling and response on top of the next generation antivirus that I described.
Saul Marquez:
Love it. Hey, listen, at the end of the day, this stuff. Let’s just be honest. It’s not sexy, but it’s important. And Sean thinks it’s sexy. And so is his team. And that’s why these are the guys you are working with you. They’re the ones keeping up with all of the updates and all of the things that make a difference in protecting your business and protecting what you work so hard to do. So, Sean, appreciate you sharing that. That’s super interesting. I’m gonna have to look up CrowdStrike.
Sean Nobles:
Absolutely. Yep. Like you said, we’re big nerds. We go to bed at night thinking about cybersecurity and we like to provide that level. Like I said earlier, companies have I.T. people already because you need it for to help out with workstations and servers, but you also need cybersecurity and it’s only getting worse. So that’s definitely where we shine.
Saul Marquez:
Love it. So time for The Lightning Round and then the book you recommend to the listeners. You’re ready.
Sean Nobles:
Yes, sir.
Saul Marquez:
All right. What’s the best way to improve health care cybersecurity?
Sean Nobles:
Sure. So just basic cyber security vulnerability assessments manage firewalls and incident handling in response.
Saul Marquez:
What’s the biggest mistake or pitfall to avoid in this area?
Sean Nobles:
I would say it comes down to the user education piece. So like hearing we’ve been in business 20 years and haven’t been hacked yet. I can understand where they’re coming from, but it’s it’s too much of a risk with everything so connected to to not be able to overcome that.
Saul Marquez:
How do you stay relevant as an organization despite constant change? That’s a good question. We aren’t chasing bleeding edge technologies in Silicon Valley that flash in the pan. You know, our message is just delivering basic cybersecurity solutions to health care companies, big or small. We’re a full time cybersecurity department and that’s what’s needed versus the next artificial intelligence machine learning solution that’s out there is let’s just get basic cybersecurity.
Saul Marquez:
Love it, man. And what’s an area of focus that drives everything at your company?
Sean Nobles:
So just like we talked about passion, go into bed at night thinking about cybersecurity and we want to protect the medical records and important information that our clients have because my own kids or my wife or family could be going to one of these health care companies that don’t have the basic cyber security. So it’s very rewarding to help out our focus I’ve mentioned a couple of times a small, medium business because they’re traditionally underserved. Larger million dollar companies have cybersecurity departments in some cases or fully staffed I.T. departments and is providing that level of cyber security coverage to companies that are underserved. It’s very rewarding.
Saul Marquez:
Love it. Great, great, great responses here, Sean. And we appreciate the education. I love if you share your favorite book with us.
Sean Nobles:
Sure. So I’ve read quite a lot. I’d say the last book that really just grabbed me and, you know, I woke up the next day feeling better than the day before is Can’t Hurt Me By David Goggins. It’s just.
Saul Marquez:
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Sean Nobles:
One of the big takeaways from it is motivation is temporary. So focus on commitment and that’s it. Just wake up the next day thinking, all right, how can I be committed to the success of health care organizations and cyber security and our current clients and commitment to employees to grow a business and all of those aspects?
Saul Marquez:
Very cool. Very cool. I love love that recommendation. David Goggins, super intense guy. He was a SEAL. Just an incredible personality, a great recommendation, Sean. Again, folks, if you want to get access to the full transcript of our conversation with Sean from Navisec Cybersecurity OutcomesRocket.health in the search bar type in N A V I S E C and you’ll be able to find the show notes as well as links to the book and every other thing that we talked about, including a link to CrowdStrike and all the tidbits that we’ve discussed. Sean, before we conclude, I’d love if you could just give us a closing thought and the best place for the listeners could continue the conversation with you guys.
Sean Nobles:
Absolutely. Thank you. Salt’s discussion has been great and I appreciate your and our listeners time. My closing thought would be to focus on the basics of cybersecurity, and we’re here to help with that. So we’re more than just trying to sell something and then move on to the next company. We truly want to be a partner and help our clients navigate. We understand how much different products are out there and everyone says that you need those products. Let’s look at your business case and figure out what you need for your business case to be more secure and prevent those breaches. And small, medium business especially, they go out of business if they get a hit, the reputation. This is all the options that are out there and the fines that are involved. So I want to be a resource to help out with that. I cringe everyone to go to our Web site that Saul mentioned or find me on LinkedIn. I’m pretty easy – Sean Noble’s happy to help out and we’re passionate about it. So, you know, we want our clients to send us your viruses, send us your phishing emails. You know, we love looking at those reverse engineering those in some cases and then sharing those with our client as something clients. Something to look out for that is affecting other clients that we have. So I really appreciate it. Happy to help anytime.
Saul Marquez:
Thanks, Sean. And we appreciate you and the work that you guys do to keep businesses and people safe. So, again, just want to give you a big thanks and appreciate you joining us.
Sean Nobles:
Thank you.
Thanks for listening to the Outcomes Rocket podcast. Be sure to visit us on the web at www.outcomesrocket.com for the show notes, resources, inspiration and so much more.
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