Future of Global Informatics_Episode 20_John Chelico: this mp3 audio file was automatically transcribed by Sonix with the best speech-to-text algorithms. This transcript may contain errors.
TJ Southern:
Hey, y’all! Welcome to the Outcomes Rocket Network – The Future of Global Informatics Podcast, where we discuss global informatics through conversations with industry leaders and innovators so that you can understand what it is, what it does, and how it shapes the healthcare of our future. I am your host, TJ Southern.
TJ Southern:
Hey, y’all! Good day, good day, good day, and welcome to another episode of the Future of Global Informatics. It’s your girl, TJ Southern, and today we actually have Dr. John. I’m going to let him pronounce his last name for you, but we have Dr. John and he is with CommonSpirit. So when we always begin the podcast, I always remind y’all get a pen and a piece of paper, because let me tell you this, I do believe that Dr. John has some gems that he is going to drop for us today as we get along in this conversation. So, Dr. John, tell the people about yourself. Tell the people about yourself.
Dr. John Chelico:
So I’m John Chelico. I am a software developer in the 1990s who went to, who ended up being an internal medicine doc and then had formal training in biomedical informatics. I would say in the 1990s I was a software developer. I worked for two health ID startups, did a lot of mobile app development for NYU Langone Medical Center, but then went on to sort of go to medical school, go to internal medicine training, and then followed by formal fellowship in biomedical informatics. I want to say before it was cool. The, I’ve been sort of a career chief medical information officer for a number of large health organizations in New York, including Health and Hospitals Corporation for Bellevue Hospital. I was director of informatics for NYU Langone for some time, and for the past ten years, I was at Northwell Health, where I was the CMIO for both tertiary hospitals that started a health system, which was rebranded in 2016 to Northwell Health, where I took on sort of a larger system role as the Chief Informatics and Innovation officer for the health system. I left earlier this year to join CommonSpirit Health, which is sort of a brand of brands, but CommonSpirit Health is a health system that now spans 22 states, hospitals that we own, we have a number of other hospitals on top of that that are joint ventures, and we support over 25,000 physicians in our sort of catchment and probably take care of over 20 million lives in the work that we do at CommonSpirit. It’s very exciting, it’s one of the largest nonprofit health systems in the country at this point.
TJ Southern:
Yes, it is. See? I told y’all, I told y’all we got somebody that’s going to drop some gems. I love the fact that he is a provider, a physician, and he knows informatics. You see, he said he’s been in informatics before it was cool. So now y’all know we are the cool kids.
Dr. John Chelico:
Totally.
TJ Southern:
So, Doctor John, tell us what inspires your current work because you said you left all those organizations and now you’re with CommonSpirit. So tell us what drives you? What’s your inspiration?
Dr. John Chelico:
I think there’s a huge opportunity to improve the healthcare that we deliver in this country. I think technology plays a huge part in that. I think there’s a lot of, you know, I think there’s a lot of culture that needs to be changed, a lot of politics needs to be changed. There’s a tidbit of technology that needs to be managed, but I think there’s an opportunity for us to sort of improve the care that we deliver and it’s very exciting for me to sort of join CommonSpirit Health, because at its core, CommonSpirit Health wants to improve the care of the communities that we are in. And I think, you know, a very big part of that has to do with sort of implementing technology in how our providers, our physicians, our nurses, our advanced APPs, as well as our patients sort of interact with our health system and the data that sort of comes from it. So … for me, and I know we can make it better together.
TJ Southern:
Let me tell you, I am like, you got my little heart over here fluttering because informatics is my passion. And then to be able to see a chief sit in a seat and be able to, you know, declare a vision and declare where you want, you know, not only the work that you’re doing but your organization to move into such a vision that is so fitting for the times that we are in, right? You talked about culture changes, you talked about technology changes, you talked about supporting, you know, the lives of your organization, the patients, and to be able to look at healthcare and healthcare information technology and see how all of that is centered around patient care, it just makes my little heart flutter that we have chiefs sitting in those seats and they know what actually needs to be done. So kudos to you, kudos to you. So what is your organization doing right now to improve outcomes? What, can you speak to some of the projects that you have going on that are improving outcomes?
Dr. John Chelico:
Yeah, definitely, at the national level and for CommonSpirit health and I’m the National Chief Medical Information Officer, that lives within our physician enterprise, and the physician enterprise really supports our 25,000 docs that are across the entire organization, providers and docs, and really even the nurses that are part of that. I would say that we are looking to sort of see places where we can actually decrease variation in care. Opportunity to, I would say normalize the data that we have, have an opportunity to have a common platform by which we can sort of deliver care in different areas, depending on where it is, but be able to sort of use the data that comes out of our electronic health record systems, our revenue cycle systems, and other, sort of, ancillary systems to actually improve the data, have a very data-driven mindset and sort of all of that. But the ability to sort of have consistency across the vision is going to be key for our future success, and I think that’s one of the things we’re trying to sort of drive at the national level. CommonSpirit Health really only came together in 2019, a little pandemic in between, so I will say this year is really kind of heads down, really trying to get us to a point where we have consistency in platforms across our enterprise, help the folks, really, that are driving all of this change in our divisions and in our individual markets, and kind of understanding where at a national level we can support those initiatives as best we can. I think it’s really a support role, I think, at a national level, more than anything else, and make sure that we have the right resources dedicated to the cause, really improving the care that we deliver.
TJ Southern:
I love that, I love that. Okay, so now you talk about the right resources. All right, so we bring this whole conversation home now, right? Because at the top of the conversation, you talked about all of your roles in informatics, right? In all of those roles that you’ve had in informatics, how often have you seen nurses been at the table with you or in the firefight with you, or in arms with you? How often have you seen those nurses with you? And do you think it’s more opportunities for nurses in that arena?
Dr. John Chelico:
Oh, I would say, how often? I would say 100% of the time.
TJ Southern:
Yes!
Dr. John Chelico:
The only reason I would say, it’s funny I’ve said this before is, I think when I studied informatics, I think the first thing I learned was how to be a nurse. I’ll put another plug-in, and I would say that being an internist, a primary care provider, and a hospitalist at times in the hospital, we don’t function without our nursing partners, and I think it’s a joint effort that we need to kind of work together.
TJ Southern:
Thank you, thank you for giving us our props. I totally, totally.
Dr. John Chelico:
Thank you, as a global piece, because I think it is working together and I think it’s working smarter. And, you know, we often say it, if everyone’s sort of working to their license to, sort of, do things that they, that below sort of what they were trained for, … people work optimally. So, you know, nobody wants to be marginalized in any way, and I think the ability for us to work together as a team, an interdisciplinary team, to really kind of take care of our patients is very important. But in informatics, I think, you know, physician informatics, but the partnership that we have with our nursing informatics colleagues is paramount because I think it’s finding those things that we can attack together or accomplish together, it’s really key.
TJ Southern:
Let me tell you, nursing informaticists and provider informaticists, that’s like the TNT of healthcare technology. Like I tell people all the time, you can’t have Jordan without Scottie Pippen. It just doesn’t work, so, you know, that is the goal to have a total, you know, team for that interdisciplinary care and have providers and nurses drive that standardization of care across healthcare systems. So again, kudos to you for recognizing that all of my providers, you listening to Dr. John now, he puts some fat on your neck, he telling you the truth. So now tell me this, because you recognize all of these things, you recognize all of the things that are happening within the changes of healthcare, the teams that are needed to drive those changes, the teams that are needed to create the standardization, but what are you most excited about as it relates to your position and what you’re going to do to support those things?
Dr. John Chelico:
Yeah, no, I think the one thing that I’m looking forward to sort of support is that really, the ability for us to sort of move to value.
TJ Southern:
Love it.
Dr. John Chelico:
Healthcare in general is in trouble in this country, and I think if we’re sort of in a place where we have fee-for-service as our main driver, it’s going to be difficult. I’m an organization with $13, $12, $13 Billion in revenue, in Northwell Health, you know, and with very little margins to sort of … initiatives. And I think at CommonSpirit Health, we are a 30-plus billion dollar organization, and I want to say that the investments made and how we capitalize on that are very hard to sort of operationalize on some of the work that we want to do to drive the healthcare we need to do. But we are seeing bright spots in value-based care and the ability for us to sort of support that in an informatics role is that those things start making sense. And I always joke, I think I probably say it way too often it’s, dollars and cents, it’s not just making sense.
TJ Southern:
Let me tell you, pennies make dollars. I tell people that all the time. Pennies make dollars. And actually, the pennies are more important than the dollars, because if you lose so many pennies, you can’t make the dollars.
Dr. John Chelico:
Right, so that’s, I mean, that’s what I’m excited for, and the ability to work in an organization where you start seeing that in some markets it’s really key to our future success in this country, and with our footprint, the ability to sort of have an effect on those things will be paramount. I think we also need to move, which you’re seeing sort of evidence of at the national level, to improve standardization of the way a lot of our vendors, our electronic health record vendors, and others are consistent with, you know, sharing data and opening up in the ability for us to sort of have that. As part of an organization that, I will say that, eventually, we’ll get to sort of common platforms, we’ll always be, you know, outliers that need to sort of be integrated in some ways, and for us to sort of harness the data in those different platforms in a consistent way is really, you need the help to partner with your industry partners to do that.
TJ Southern:
Man, I love the fact that you dot our team, everything is a team, you cannot do it by yourself, guys. And for so long, the information technology part of healthcare has been very siloed. And so now you guys see us in healthcare moving in the direction of visuality, of allowing other vendors, allowing other teams within the organizations to see each other’s works, right? It’s not just, oh, you know, this department is over here doing the work and no one else can see it. Now, the work, because of the electronic medical record and because of all the other remote vendors that we have, there has to be one common thread where people can see all of the work, and so that is what it seems like a lot of organizations are moving to, and I give all of them kudos for that. Not only does it make the work transparent among the teammates, but then it gives a sense of value, a sense of pride, and also a sense of belonging to not only the staff members but to the chief suite, or the C-suite, and then you start to create this culture of belonging amongst your patients. So it has more ripple effects than just your inside team guys. It has effects over the whole entire culture of your organization. So yes, yes. So now I’m going to ask you a hard question, actually. What do you think needs to be talked about more to bring awareness to the role of informatics? Now, I’m not just talking about provider informatics, I’m not talking just about nursing informatics, I’m talking about informatics in general. Because we still have healthcare providers that don’t know or don’t understand what informatics is and what it does, and how it plays such a vital role in healthcare. So what do you think needs to be talked about more in order to bring awareness to that role, or that discipline?
Dr. John Chelico:
You know, what defines the provider in the past is maybe wearing a stethoscope or, you know, working with their patients. I think you have to see the technology that we’re using to document the care and to prescribe, or find the right diagnosis for your patient, or find the right treatment options for a patient, or deliver the right care is only done through some technology solution. And I think your electronic health record system is almost part and parcel of any other modality of you sort of taking care of that patient.
TJ Southern:
Yes, it is.
Dr. John Chelico:
Almost, it’s almost like, it’s almost absurd to really take care of a patient without those things.
TJ Southern:
Yes, it is.
Dr. John Chelico:
I think you have to learn to use your electronic health record system resources for your benefit, your patients’ benefit, to deliver the right care, and these are tools like anything else. You have to have the tool and you have to know how to use the tool. And I think, you know, much like, you know, we’re defined by a stethoscope around your neck or a scalpel in your hand or whatever the case may be, you know, the electronic health record is something that is of a tool that you have to use to your benefit and your patients’ benefit. And that’s really at the heart of informatics, is actually using the tools properly and how we can create the tools, develop the tools to sort of help you do your job best is really the role of informatics.
TJ Southern:
And that’s, and that’s it, that is, that’s it, plain simple. Dr. John can drop the mic now. It is, informatics is a tool and there are a lot of healthcare providers or individuals coming into this healthcare space that don’t understand informatics, and they kind of get frustrated about it because they don’t understand it, and then they hear us tossing this word informatics around. But to understand informatics as, at its core, it is really the analyzing of all of the healthcare data that we’re getting here from all of these different points, right? From our blood pressure cup, from our …, from our, you know, we’re getting all of these data points and we’re putting them into one pot, right, and we’re cooking it all up for our patients. So have those informaticists, whether they be, like you said, that’s the way that providers used to be, you know, designated this as the white coat, stethoscope, scalpel. You know, things have changed quite a bit, and so now you have us, you have the providers that, we’re providers, but now we’re on the technology side helping to better patient outcomes. So thank you for so eloquently giving us that. So now, what words of wisdom do you have left for our future informaticists or providers or healthcare individuals that are wanting to come into informatics? And I’m going to say this, because it seems to me like you have a near and dear love for informatics just like I do, so I know that you got some nuggets to drop for us. So what are your parting words of wisdom for our listeners, for our guests?
Dr. John Chelico:
I will say that to be a good informaticist, you have to be very humble, and practical, and experienced to understand why we are in the place we are. And I think, in every job that I’ve been in, every opportunity that’s come to provide me, to sort of improve what it was, I think you have to understand why it is where we got there. And I will say that in every place there’s always been someone who’s been there a lot longer than I have that kind of understands the environment a lot longer than I have. And I think you have to really kind of understand when you’re going into a hospital trying to transform the care that’s being delivered, you’re going into a physician’s office and understand how they’ve been doing things for 20, 30, 40 years. It’s really humbling to say, you know, that’s work, and I think now we have to look at ways to make it work better, but you have to do it in the context of that history. So that’s really what it is. I think it’s, informatics is a very humbling experience, and I think that you have to sort of understand what got them there to sort of, get you to sort of the next level. And I think the understanding is, hey, what you got you here is not going to get you sort of to the next chapter, is a major piece of informatics, but at the same rate, they got there successfully. And you really can’t deny that fact that like, this is, wherever you’re going in has been successful for many, many years and you’re just looking to tweak things to sort of make it one step, one step better in the future. So, be humble in whatever you do is probably my big takeaway.
TJ Southern:
Hey, y’all! Thanks for joining us today for another episode of the Outcomes Rocket Network – The Future of Global Informatics Podcast. If your organization is looking for informatics talent, go to www.Beryllus.net. That is www. B E R Y L L U S .net, and we can assist you in finding some of the best nursing informatics talent this continent has to offer. We’ll talk to you later! Have a great day! See ya!
Sonix has many features that you’d love including world-class support, automated subtitles, enterprise-grade admin tools, share transcripts, and easily transcribe your Zoom meetings. Try Sonix for free today.
