Improving Outcomes for Seniors through Virtual Advising of Family Caregivers with Naveen Kathuria, CEO at eFamily Care: Audio automatically transcribed by Sonix

Improving Outcomes for Seniors through Virtual Advising of Family Caregivers with Naveen Kathuria, CEO at eFamily Care: this mp3 audio file was automatically transcribed by Sonix with the best speech-to-text algorithms. This transcript may contain errors.

Saul Marquez:
Welcome back to the Outcomes Rocket everybody, Saul Marquez is here, and today I have the privilege of hosting the outstanding Naveen Kathuria. Naveen is the Chief Executive Officer at eFamilyCare. He’s a health executive with 20 plus years of broad-based experience and strategy, compliance operations, and business development with high-growth organizations. Naveen worked as a corporate attorney for two top-tier global law firms focusing on mergers and acquisitions within a variety of industries, including health care. He co-founded a preventative care and wellness company with a number of locations around the Chicagoland area. He also worked as a management consultant specializing in advising health systems and health plans on buy-side and sell-side transactions. Most recently, Naveen was an early-stage sales and compliance executive at a technology-enabled behavioral health startup focused on top-line revenue while navigating a complex regulatory landscape and ultimately resulting in building the largest tell US psychiatric organization in the country. Naveen received his bachelor’s from the University of Michigan and his Juris Doctor from Boston University of School of Law, and he is just doing extraordinary work in health care. And today I’m excited to host him here for all of you, so Naveen, thank you so much for joining us today.

Naveen Kathuria:
Saul, thanks so much for having me. Appreciate you taking the time to learn about me and our organization.

Saul Marquez:
Thank you. Yeah. I’ve been so great that you’re here with us. You know, the things in health care are changing. Care to the home is becoming a reality. We’re going to touch on what eFamilyCare is doing to help do that more effectively. But before we do that, I’d love to just spend a little time here getting to know you. And what is it exactly inspires you to work in health care?

Naveen Kathuria:
Sure, yeah. And again, I appreciate you taking the time to speak with me. What inspires me to work in health care and particularly in the capacity that I do, which is in a high-growth startup organization working to innovate and disrupt traditional mechanisms of dddressing issues within health care. Well, first of all, there’s a lot that needs to be done, right? There’s a lot of complex issues within health care. There aren’t easy solutions. It’s a sophisticated regulatory landscape. The health care ecosystem is difficult to navigate. And as you noted in my background, I’ve been a management consultant and I’ve been a corporate attorney. I’ve been involved in trying to solve complex problems. And what I really like about health care is there are these sophisticated and complex problems. And what I love about what we do here is family care. And what I’ve done with the startup world for a while now is to try to tackle these problems, but then to work on the execution of the solutions we come up with.

Naveen Kathuria:
The guy’s a management consultant. As an attorney, a lot of times we’re coming up with solutions. We’ll address something. We’ll execute on a merger. And then what was missing for me was always sort of how did this workout? Right. Like we came up with a solution. We gave some advice on what to do then how what was the impact of that? And so what we’re really focused on here is family care is the impact of what we do, not just how can we solve a complex issue, how can we address something that’s been sort of an issue within health care for a long time in terms of empowering and supporting family caregivers. But then how is that addressing the issue? How can we measure outcomes? I think one of the things I love about your podcast is you’re really focused on what are the solutions that are out there and how are those making an impact, not just what are the problems?

Saul Marquez:
Yeah, you know, that’s fantastic. And getting focused on those solutions is key. Your experience in both law and also the consultancy space on the provider and payer side is something that that really, I think, provides a broad brush stroke of understanding to the approach that you guys are taking. So let’s hone in on eFamilyCare. Tell us a little bit about what you guys are up to and how you’re adding value to the health care ecosystem.

Naveen Kathuria:
Sure. Yeah. And maybe I’ll just start with the problems that we see and that we’re trying to address, which is really that we’re shifting towards in-home care more and more. And that was happening prior to this pandemic. And we want to keep people out of higher acuity settings. We want to make people more comfortable. A lot of people are more comfortable addressing issues that they have within the home. Now, you layer on a pandemic where there’s more of a shift towards in-home services, there’s distrust in facilities. I mean, I think there’s a statistic out there that was about five percent of all cases occurred in these nursing homes and other long-term care facilities, and that accounted for about 40 percent of the mortality. And so there’s a distrust in going into facilities. There’s a further amplified focus on in-home care. And where does that burden fall in terms of the care of the individuals in the home? First of all, of course, it’s the providers, but how are the providers access these members? And if you think about vulnerable populations, what we’re focused on is vulnerable populations. So it’s a lot of times disabled individuals, senior populations, the caregivers who are unpaid who certainly burdened with caring for their loved ones, particularly the family caregivers. They’re the ones that bear the burden and don’t necessarily have support out there. And so we are aiming to address that issue through a technology-enabled solution. So high tech and high support. So really what we’re doing is we’re providing a technology that’s built to be really engaging, that provides resources to these family caregivers. And then we have care advisors who are social workers or nurses with 10 plus years of geriatric experience typically. So a lot of times we’re working with caregivers who are caring for Mom or Dad. And so these care advisers are the high touch portion of what we’re doing. So we’re really a technology-enabled service that aims to support and advise and empower these family caregivers as they try to navigate a difficult or complex health care ecosystem in caring for their aging loved ones.

Saul Marquez:
Yeah, that’s fantastic. And it is a huge gap, right? I mean, we have this huge gap where care is moving to the home and, you know, frankly, it’s been there. It’s not moving there. It’s been there. And now we are more focused on going beyond that. Hey, you know, episodic care, come visit. You’re primary care provider and then go home and don’t come back whether or not you have chronic conditions or not, which the majority of the elderly do. So this opportunity to monitor through this door, this additional source of data is a huge opportunity for us to make people more healthy. So it’s exciting that you guys are focused here, first of all. And I mean, why don’t you talk to us a little bit about what you believe makes you guys different and better than what’s out there?

Naveen Kathuria:
Sure. Well, I think, first and foremost, we’re focused. Everything is built around supporting the family caregiver, the unpaid caregiver for these vulnerable populations. There’s not much that’s out there that is. I mean, you know, as you had mentioned in the introduction, I work in an organization where we provide behavioral health to vulnerable populations. And that was really a rewarding experience. But what I found is that a lot of times when we’re trying to target vulnerable populations and deliver telemedicine, then this was telepsychiatry and teletherapy, they’re not necessarily in the best position to care about an aging population, to be able to leverage or utilize a technology solution. And so the first, the biggest difference about what we do is we’re built around supporting a family caregiver. And there’s a lot of research and statistics out there that show these family caregivers are in a better position to be able to utilize technology and also want to. So a lot of family caregivers who are caring, for example, their loved ones, their sandwich generation. So they’re caring for their kids as well. They want to be able to leverage technology and maybe shoot out a message and get a response. So we have both videos, so synchronous interaction with our care advisors, but then also asynchronous, which would be messaging through our platform so you could shoot out a message and get a response within two hours. I think that’s another really important part of what we do. So I think those two areas.

Naveen Kathuria:
One thing I would mention is sort of the work I did again at my prior organization was a lot in rural areas. And so if you think about populations that are in rural areas that don’t necessarily have the capability or the bandwidth to be able to engage in a video visit, I think it’s really impactful to be able to offer them the ability to, through their mobile phone, shoot a message to someone and get a response that’s meaningful, that’s contextual because these people have that much experience of 10 plus years working as a clinician, as a nurse or social worker. And so getting that type of response can be really helpful for them when they’re time-constrained. So I think those are the areas where we think we’re really differentiating ourselves.

Saul Marquez:
Yeah, that’s great. You know, having that reliable platform that, you know, you could go to help your family member is huge. And then from a pairing perspective, knowing that you’re providing and even a provider perspective, knowing you’re providing the family members of the person you’re caring for, the tools that they need to help them stay healthy. We’re talking about Medicare Advantage dollars here that are finite and we need to do the best with what we have, right?

Naveen Kathuria:
Yeah, absolutely. That’s really who we’re partnering with is Medicare Advantage manage Medicaid, the long-term supports and services.cAnd then, as you mentioned, provider side, as well as health systems, hospitals, primary care groups. And really we talk about ourselves as being able to be the eyes and ears in the home. If you think about a primary care clinician, as you have noted earlier, there are a lot of times seeing a patient telling them to do some things and then sending them home. But a lot of times the complaint is that the physician part is that we don’t actually know if they’re compliant with what we’re asking them to do in terms of the care plan. And so wouldn’t it be great if you could actually interact with the caregiver who is primarily responsible for the care of that loved one and basically advise them and also ensure that they are adhering to that care plan? And so that’s where really we believe the investment of the health plans and providers is better served, where we’re actually supporting that investment through the caregiver and our support of them.

Saul Marquez:
Now, that’s fantastic. And look, a lot of times, these programs, solutions, we really look for evidence that we’re improving outcomes, that we’re optimizing times and dollars. Can you speak to how you guys are doing this?

Naveen Kathuria:
Yeah, absolutely. I think that you touched on the main aspects of what we’ve seen. So a reduction in cost, so reduction and unnecessary hospitalization rates. If you think about a knee-jerk reaction, if you’re a manager, a loved one, you don’t have To support. The first thing you’re going to do if you’re worried about them is probably take them into a hospital setting, an emergency department and maybe perhaps they get admitted. And what we hear from health plans and health systems and hospitals and provider groups is a lot of times those are unnecessary hospitalizations that could have been managed if they had the ability to get in touch with that member. But again, going back to what I was talking about before, a lot of times that member of that patient isn’t in the best position to answer the phone if they’re getting a call from a random number or to utilize a technology solution. So if you have the caregiver who’s in a position to be able to actually interact through technology and also who we’re building a relationship with.

Naveen Kathuria:
I spoke about our care advisors, what we do and what we did it my organization is well, it’s continuity of care. It’s the same care advisor building rapport and a relationship with these caregivers to establish trust. And I think that’s such a super important component. There’s so much distrust in health care. There’s a lot of surveys that are out there about that. And so you really want to build trust over time and then they’ll confide in you and then they know it’s a face, a name attached to it. So now when something comes up, they know who to go to and they trust the decision-making of the person they’re going to and to support. So the reduction in costs is one area and then it improves satisfaction and experience of the member. Many times the caregivers responsible again for the care of that member. So if we can make them feel more supported, that’s going to then directly affect the satisfaction of the patient. And so those are the two components that most health systems and health plans are focused on, is a reduction in cost and improvement in experience or satisfaction. And those are the two areas we’re most focused on.

Saul Marquez:
That’s awesome. So what you’re telling me, Naveen is that there’s a human being answering their call or asynchronously communicating through text, through the app. But there’s somebody there that they know. And this is a consistent person.

Naveen Kathuria:
Yeah, exactly. And I mentioned this. I think I jumbled it at the beginning, but high tech. High touch. Right. So, I mean, it’s not just a technology solution. And if you think about what the pandemic has done and people want human interaction. Right. And so I think that’s an important point is that we’re not just a technology that’s a chatbot or something, that someone has to go and raise their hand and then go into the technology and search for something. We certainly have the capability within our platform to be able to do that through your phone or through your browser. But it’s also that human element, I think that’s something I’ve learned within health care that is really important to drive engagement and interaction and then ultimately outcomes are that human services component of a solution.

Saul Marquez:
Man, that’s awesome. I’m glad we honed in on that for a little bit because it’s so valuable to have somebody that you could establish trust with instead of just the bot. You know, it’s like bots are great. There’s a place for them, but there’s only so much trust you can establish with a brand or a company. You’re not going to do it through a bot. You’re just not.

Naveen Kathuria:
Yeah, I think, as you said, there’s a place for those as well. I don’t mean to demean the importance of having access to data and having bots that can help to treat someone appropriately, totally to sort of a Human Resource. But there’s no replacement of that human interaction, particularly when you think about caregivers and the stress and the burden that they’re under and potentially isolation. And if they want to be able to confide in someone and talk to them in giving them that ability can help improve outcomes over time. And so that’s really what we lean heavily into, is that human interaction and having someone on the other side of the line to be able to interact with.

Saul Marquez:
Fantastic. That’s great. Thank you. So as you reflect on the journey, what would you say is one of the biggest setbacks you’ve experienced and a key learning that has made you guys all the better?

Naveen Kathuria:
Sure. And I’m probably going to be generic with my response because most people will probably say this as well. But the pandemic certainly impacted how we go about doing business. And if you think about what we’re doing and I just mentioned the human elements and components of being able to support these caregivers, much of what I’ve done throughout my career is meeting with people and understanding where their pain points are to be able to adapt our solution towards what their pain points are. Harder to do that via video. And a lot of what I did in the past is going and meeting with folks and understanding. I worked a lot in my organization with Native American tribes, For example, and I would travel to reservations across the country to understand the behavioral issues that these tribal members go through and built a program around the same way as we’re interacting with organizations across the country, whether it be health plans, health systems. Provider groups meeting with them in person was typically how we did business and now we don’t have that ability. So it’s getting to know people over video is something that we have to make sure to emphasize and really understanding more about them and what drives them to do what they do and then sort of getting into our solution and how we can help them, which traditionally would be easier in an in-person meeting. And I think the other part about it is just from an internal standpoint, as managing team members and interacting with them and collaborating again when you’re not in an office setting. That’s how I was traditionally used to doing things. Now it’s all virtual with the folks all over. So I think that’s one of the sort of challenges we’ve had. But I think it’s forced us to adapt and to figure out ways to better engage with people virtually and to make sure to set aside time to get to know them personally and not just touch on the work components and what we can do to support or partner with them.

Saul Marquez:
Yeah, you know, do you feel like the pandemic has normalized the virtual and thus helped in a way make your model even more scalable?

Naveen Kathuria:
Yeah, I think that so. You know, I mentioned the challenge and how we’ve overcome it, but it has presented opportunities. Well, I think, as I mentioned, the pandemic has forced more people into the home, more people to think about how can I care for mom and dad because I don’t want them in a facility, given what’s happened in the distrust that they have in typical long term care facilities. And so it’s created more opportunities. It’s just about understanding where that opportunity is and then making sure we’re meeting that need. But certainly, it’s presented an opportunity.

Saul Marquez:
Yeah, that’s great. So, Naveen, you guys are hitting on a really great spot here, I think, where we need more focus and we need those tools and platforms to take care of our loved ones. What would you say you’re most excited about today?

Naveen Kathuria:
You know, I think I’m most excited about this being recognized more and more. I mean, even over the past few months. An author by the name of Kate Washington, she had a personal issue with caregiving and she shared it. She published an article in The New York Times and had a chance to talk to her about her caregiving journey. And again, there’s just more publicity out there about this New England Journal of Medicine. Put something out. Joe Biden put out an infrastructure bill that’s two trillion dollars and four hundred billion of it is towards what they call a cash economy and designated towards elderly and those the care for elderly and those with disabilities and really calls out family caregivers as an underappreciated resource and sort of providing more support to them. So I think the general recognition that this is something that needs to be addressed is something that’s really exciting because we actually think about it started with the name and it was focused on patient costs and outcomes. And then you added on quadrupling, which was then provider.

Naveen Kathuria:
And the experience with the providers we’re having, we really think about it is the quintupling like if you really have family members who are responsible for the care of their loved ones in the home and are communicating about the care and the needs that they have, that can then be communicated back to providers who often don’t have that capability of interacting meaningfully with them while they’re in the home. So we think about it as a quintupling with the caregivers being that fifth part of this sort of focus to improve outcomes, reduce costs, et cetera.

Saul Marquez:
Yeah, that’s awesome. You know that is definitely the right macro picture. And I’m glad you mentioned that for some of her, the quintuple aim, and I love it. So, yeah.

Naveen Kathuria:
You know, our co-founder came up with that as a term. And I think it really resonated with me in terms of what I’m passionate about.

Saul Marquez:
Yeah. You know, and you lay the framework that’s familiar and you’re like, wow, you’re right. You know, we’ve been leaving out the caregiver. We have.

Naveen Kathuria:
And yeah. And really, I mean, actually and backing up to sort of why we are here, what our mission is, why are we here as an organization. eFamilyCare – because our co-founders, Dr. Eric Rackow and Larry Sosnow, and buil Senior Bridge, which is acquired by Humana to become human at home. They were managing chronically ill populations in the home through phone calls and through home-based care, and recognize that family caregivers were often burdened with the care of their loved ones. And so wouldn’t it be great to have a solution that’s more of a technology solution? So digital, not analog. And wouldn’t it be great to allow people to interact via video so they could attach a face to the name and then asynchronous messaging or text messaging or whatever you want to call it, to be able to shoot a message out and get a response within a couple of hours? And so that’s really why this company came about, is because they have successfully managed chronically ill populations in the home, but noticed the gap and built a solution around that gap to address that issue. Yeah.

Saul Marquez:
Now it makes a lot of sense. A very experienced founding team, board of directors. And with you as a CEO, I think the company’s got a very promising future. And you guys are really working on an area that is where the puck is going. And so there’s some major growth ahead. I see it. So kudos to you guys. I appreciate you jumping on and sharing some of the work that you guys are doing At eFamilyCare, Naveen. Before we conclude the chat today. I love if you could just leave us with a closing thought and then the best way that the listeners could get in touch with you or anyone on your team to explore the possibility of working with you guys.

Naveen Kathuria:
Sure. Yeah. Thank you so much for having me on. Really enjoyed the conversation. In terms of closing thought, I think, you know, as I mentioned, this is an exciting time within health care. There’s a lot of innovation that can happen. There’s a lot of disruption. I think people are recognizing that. What I would say is just not forgetting about the human element of technology solutions. And I think there’s a lot out there. There’s a lot of opportunity within telehealth and digital health and remote patient monitoring, but really focusing on human interaction and the service component and not just technology will allow for better adoption, better engagement and ultimately better outcomes. In terms of how to get a hold of me. I’m not super active on social media. I don’t have a Twitter handle, but LinkedIn phone or email, I’m happy to share that, if that’s helpful. My email is nkathuria@efamilycare.com. And anyone could also call me anytime. My phone number is 617-953-8452. Certainly passionate about the work we do and look forward to chatting with anyone about how we could potentially help them.

Saul Marquez:
That’s fantastic. I mean, and folks, this is the time. I mean, if the discussion with Naveen moved something inside of you or you kind of caught yourself saying, yeah, yeah, yes. Quintupling. Yes. I mean, why would you wait, pause that podcast, and call, you know, hit that rewind. You could rewind it by fifteen seconds and call them or email. I think the opportunity is there. So take action on any inspiration you have. That’s how things happen. And so really, really grateful for you Naveen. And I think it’s exciting the work that you guys are up to. So I appreciate you jumping on and looking forward to staying in touch.

Naveen Kathuria:
Thanks so much and likewise.

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