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Saul Marquez:
Hey everybody! Saul Marquez with the HLTH Matters podcast. Thanks so much for tuning in again. As a reminder, if this is your first time here, make sure you hit the subscribe button so all of these interviews straight from the HLTH experience floor go straight to your podcast inbox because you’re not going to want to miss any one of these. Today, I have Jordan Penn on the podcast. In the past decade, Jordan spent his career in healthcare as a storyteller, leveraging healthcare data and analytics to follow the patient journey, assist in research, and more. His expert knowledge of medical and pharmacy claims, lab data, and EMR/EHR has made extraordinary contributions for his clients, and he also has been deeply involved with analyzing patient journeys to support HEOR studies. At Inovalon, Jordan is a senior principal sales engineer working cross-functionally between sales, product, engineering, marketing, and legal to bring new ideas to existing product offerings. In the podcast that we do together, we look in the rearview mirror to the history of how we’ve gotten to where we are, the pathway to how we’ve adapted electronic medical records, interoperability in our advancements, and fast forward to today and in the future, what we’re doing about it to improve care delivery and access. So with that, I want to welcome Jordan to the podcast. So glad that you could be here with us.
Jordan Penn:
Yeah, thanks for having me, Saul, really happy to be here.
Saul Marquez:
Absolutely, so Inovalon, you guys are doing such interesting things and we’re going to dive into, specifically, how you guys are helping shape the future of healthcare. Prior to that, though, I’d love to hear from you on what is it that inspires your work in healthcare?
Jordan Penn:
Yeah, so I’ve been in the healthcare industry for probably about a decade. I’m really driven by basically, you know, even though I work in what I consider IT and technology, I like to think that the work that I’m doing behind a keyboard or things like that, like I’m driving better health outcomes. That’s really the kind of the crux and really kind of I’m very passionate about and kind of is, really just makes me happy to go to work every day and really help, that I’m hopefully impacting someone’s life for the better, again, behind a keyboard.
Saul Marquez:
Yeah, hey, but listen, when you’re working in healthcare, that’s exactly what it is.
Jordan Penn:
Exactly. Exactly.
Saul Marquez:
So I totally feel you there, and I think there’s an opportunity. I heard that your team has a product that could fill in patient gaps that can lead to better treatment. Can you tell me more about this?
Jordan Penn:
Yeah, absolutely, so really, with this so this product is called DataStream. It’s delivered via an API, and really with that, it is identified patient data really meant to empower treatment scenarios, and it’s, with the data that we’re leveraging, it’s our closed claims data, again, through our unique partnerships in the healthcare space. So we touch a lot of whether it’s payer or pharmacy, life science organization. So we’re, we have our, you know, we’re all over the place with what we’re doing and it’s great work. So really with that, we’re able to leverage our claims data as well as our EHR data and our partnerships there to deliver that single source of truth and really deliver that comprehensive patient data for provider, whether it’s a pharmacist, telehealth doctor, EMS worker, and it’s not just data, we also, with DataStream API, we’re leveraging what’s called our clinical intelligence engine, and that is deduplication, normalization, standardization, and it’s a series of rules. So it’s basically like almost like AI-like and giving the doctor exactly what they need at that point of care.
Saul Marquez:
Nice, and so they’re taking a look at this information, these insights. Is it showing up on the EMR screen?
Jordan Penn:
Yeah, exatly, so that’s one of the.
Saul Marquez:
It’s integrated.
Jordan Penn:
Yeah, exactly, so since we are, think of us really as the smart pipes, we are the data that’s connecting to an existing EMR, you know, really we’re EMR agnostic, we’re, you know, we’re happy to work with everybody in any way.
Saul Marquez:
Cerner, Epic, Meditech, all of them.
Jordan Penn:
Yes, sir. I would say too, like with that, it’s frictionless in the sense that our goal to, is not to impact the existing workflows. We’re merely meant to complement that and really to help and give the provider actionable intel to drive those better patient health outcomes.
Saul Marquez:
Love it, yeah, look, in today’s clinical world, having tools that augment as well as help simplify your workflows are the most attractive ones. So talk to us about why your solution is so important.
Jordan Penn:
Yeah, so really our solution is really important in the sense that we are delivering those better patient health outcomes. We’re sitting on this data and a lot of the things that we’re seeing with this product and really with kind of our foyer, so this product is relatively new. We’ve been around for less than a year with this identified patient data solution, and a lot of the conversations that we’ve had, it’s, you know, our clients are either of two problems, either they don’t have any data or they have way too much data and they can’t make sense of it. So what we’re trying to do is really demystify or declutter that or give them better information and really kind of go around and assist the provider with treating a patient.
Saul Marquez:
That’s fantastic. You know, we are always looking for ways, and at this conference in particular, in HLTH, where the topic has been, how do we improve the patient experience?
Jordan Penn:
Exactly, yeah. No, please, that’s great. So that’s something I can, I’m extremely passionate about that. I think with, you know, our end user is the provider, is the clinician, but our client’s client, it’s you and me. It’s every aspect of healthcare because I’m sure we’ve all been in a situation where we were very frustrated with some sort of, or not just us, but a family member or something like that. And really it’s frustrating, the sense it’s like if there’s just a better way or if this doctor knew, you know, X, Y, and Z had that information or maybe had that kind of full patient data or the full patient history, they could have made a different decision and that could have led to a different outcome.
Saul Marquez:
Yeah, no, totally. And so can you elaborate a little more on the background of interoperability and electronic healthcare data?
Jordan Penn:
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, so buckle up because we’re in for a little bit of a history lesson. So the first thing I want to start and kind of talk about what this is, back in 2009, so there was the HITECH act that was passed under the Obama administration. It was a part of a stimulus package and really it was aimed at increasing economic efficiencies through healthcare, through science, and things like that. One of the interesting things that this act did was incentivize providers, hospitals, to really adopt electronic health records. So an interesting thing to note is that in 2000, I think this is 2008, roughly about 10% of hospitals had electronic health records. Maybe about seven or eight years later, that number’s skyrocketed to over 95% for hospitals and 85% for providers. So when you think of that information that we’re leveraging through DataStream, it’s kind of enabling that and kind of proliferating that data and bringing that data to life and giving it that electronic sense. So no longer will we rely on faxes and paper copies and things like that. And then from 2009, fast forward about seven or eight years, so the 21st Century Cures Act was passed in December 2016, and really, that was kind of building on and improving efficiencies across the life sciences, across the healthcare industry. So one of the things with the 21st Century Cures Act was this whole concept of interoperability. It’s a buzzword, we see it on a lot of these booths and things like that, it’s very fascinating. But with the Office of the National Coordinator of Health Information Technology and the Center for Medicaid, Medicare, and Medicaid, they had this framework or these rules really talking about interoperability. And their whole thing was with interoperability, like you should be able to access patient information or medical patient information without any special use by or any special need by the user. So it shouldn’t be kind of constrained to like a, one system or things like that, this data should be available to improve healthcare to really drive those outcomes. And then the other thing I want to know too, is about in, leading into and kind of talking about DataStream and our API. So in, you know, with these rules and with the 21st Century Cures Act, a lot of the industry experts, they called for like this public API or something, ability to transmit all this healthcare data, because you think about all the different structures and formats and kind of the routes we could have taken, you know, it’s really driving say, hey, we need a standard. There needs to be a way to serve, you know, diagnosis information, lab information, medication information to all these different systems and make them all connected, and really that’s the goal, is to, you know, if we can have all this information, the provider can have this information, we could drive better health outcomes. So really, really, with that one final thing or one part of the final part of the history lesson, in 2020, CMS actually had their patient access final rule, and from that final rule, they basically mandated a lot of the CMS agency. So Medicare Advantage plans, Medicaid state plans, as well as plans on the federal marketplace, actually had to use this pretty much this … standard to transmit data. And you know, we’ve come a long way, but there’s still so much work to do. Having a lot of great conversations here at HLTH, you know, with some people that support FHIR with things like that. I mean, there’s still a long ways to go, and, you know, we’re in it for the long haul with that. It’s really that the crux of what we do is everything we’re doing, we’re doing to improve those patient health outcomes.
Saul Marquez:
That’s fantastic, Jordan, and I really appreciate the rearview mirror on really what has been the digitization of healthcare through EHR and then the access to the data through APIs with FHIR, and now we’re here. So the opportunity is big to be able to do more with what we have available. We’re here at HLTH with the goal to advance healthcare. It’s about the single mission. How is your company innovating and doing their distinct part?
Jordan Penn:
Yeah, no, so with DataStream, really, our goal is to kind of break down a lot of those barriers and enable better treatment for providers, for physicians. And there’s a number of use cases or kind of instances that were our avenues that we’re working down. So when you think of, it’s, telehealth or EMS, you know, if you’re first on scene and you’re leveraging our tools, you know, if this patient is unresponsive or they’re unconscious, like you have a lot of information on them already, you know, whether it’s their ID, someone, someone else, they’re kind of assist you, but also too, you think of telehealth, really where those interactions it’s, you don’t have like a steady relationship with a telehealth doctor, not like your PCP, but then if you’re through DataStream, they’re seeing all this information. So they could see, oh, Jordan, you know, he’s taking these medications, he had a hospitalization three months ago. Like is the condition or the reason why he has this telehealth visit, is it related to those other drugs? Like maybe now I have better information and really from there can drive that conversation forward and really empower the providers and enable them to do more and take that consultative approach. And then also too, kind of break down some of that admin work because that’s something too, you know, just kind of working with, some clinicians do it and …, you know, a lot of the things that they talk about too is just, you know, kind of overburdened with a lot of the administrative side. And that’s another thing too, with DataStream, we could help alleviate that and kind of break some of those barriers down.
Saul Marquez:
That’s great, Jordan, thank you for walking us through. The platform is essentially an opportunity for physicians not to have to start at zero, right? You walk in whether it’s a telehealth visit or an in-person visit, you know the history of that patient. So what happens if a patient leaves a health system and goes to another one?
Jordan Penn:
Exactly, yeah, so that’s really great. So when we think about it, you know, typically within those large health systems, we’re getting kind of two types of data. So we have the EHR side and a lot of these large payer providers, these big systems, they still have gaps, because if a patient goes outside of that system and, you know, maybe they come back or things like that, or they’re seeing a specialist that’s not within that purview, there are still kind of blinders on the data, so it’s like you don’t know what you don’t know. With DataStream and really leveraging the claim side as well as the EHR side, we have a lot of kind of those, the connectivity across a lot of these EHR consortiums where we’re working to improve care by marrying these two data sources together. So I come from a real-world data background and a lot of the things like working with life sciences, working with pharma companies, really the closed claims data, and having that kind of full patient capture was always, you know, was always great, but then when you marry that with the EHR data and that clinical rich data, so I mentioned kind of like being a fly on the wall, it’s the gold standard. And what we’re doing is we think of patient journeys and patient studies, from that perspective, it always made sense, and now we’re able to bring that to an identified sense, it’s just, it’s great. It’s really kind of enabling and empowering the providers to leverage this information and make better decisions.
Saul Marquez:
Got it, so in that respect, if the other health system was also on the platform, you would pull from the claims data to be able to piece together the picture.
Jordan Penn:
Exactly, exactly, so someone, one of our senior leaders at our organization, one of the things kind of when I first joined Inovalon, he told me a story about his father and how he went to one hospital, had a ton of diagnostic tests performed, and then they had to go to a different hospital system and they did all of those tests again. So it’s like the frustrating aspect, it’s not just, you know, you’re worrying about your father or your family member and all these conditions, but now it’s like you’re putting through all that testing again where it’s like, if you guys just spoke to each other and, you know, we had this information that we could just share across, kind of across the wall and kind of break down that walled garden approach and then just make this data available to every, all these treating entities, all these providers, all these hospitals. It’s like, why couldn’t we just do that? Like, that’s, so that’s kind of one of the things that really is meaningful. And I said this earlier, but like, we’ve all had that experience with, you know, in healthcare because it’s great, but there’s just a lot of things that we can make better. And that’s one of the things that if we can give, if we can kind of serve up data in a better way and empower those providers, then then it’s really just music to my ears.
Saul Marquez:
Absolutely, that’s the Holy Grail, right, to be at that point where you don’t have to waste, you know, time, money, duplicative testing, that’s the place we want to be. I appreciate that. So what do listeners need to do to find more about Inovalon and the things that you guys do know?
Jordan Penn:
Absolutely, so, you know, I mentioned like Inovalon, we do a lot, you know, Inovalon.com is always a great spot. So specifically with our DataStream API and really if there’s someone that’s interested in the identified patient data, we have a sandbox environment where you can connect, we can get access in pretty much within 5 minutes, you can hit our test data, you can start developing your solution because really, as I mentioned earlier, there’s.
Saul Marquez:
Sounds easy.
Jordan Penn:
Yeah, there’s the easy button on there. With that, it’s, you’re basically, you’re developing your solution. I mentioned, it’s that frictionless kind of integration. We’re not, our goal is to not change your workflow, our goal is to not have the provider, you know, they’re using their EMR and then, oh wait, I got to log in to this other system. What’s my password? Oh, I forgot. Like, it’s, we’re connected there, and from there, you know, we’re really giving, it’s that seamless integration that we’re serving up this clinical rich information, this depth, this breadth of data for the provider and empowering them to improve those healthcare interactions.
Saul Marquez:
That’s fantastic. Well, Jordan, I got to thank you for spending time with us today and sharing more about this amazing platform. What closing thought would you leave to the listeners?
Jordan Penn:
That’s great, yeah, so I know I shared a lot of information, but really closing thoughts, thinking about our main focus is we’re very patient-centric. You know, kind of the tagline at Inovalon is, data has a story to tell, we give it a voice, and like we are that through and through, whether it’s identified patient data, de-identified patient data, a whole host of our other SaaS applications, like we’re trying to make healthcare work for everybody and really just kind of contribute to the greater good of our society.
Saul Marquez:
That’s awesome, well, I really appreciate what you and the Inovalon team are doing to make care more accessible, make it easier on clinicians. And folks, for all of the details on today’s podcast, make sure you go to the show notes. Inside of those show notes, you’ll get a link to Inovalon as well as all of the resources that we touched on, as well as ways to connect with Jordan and the team over there to try out this API because there’s a great opportunity for you to improve those care flow experiences. Jordan, thank you so much for being with us.
Jordan Penn:
Hey Saul, thank you so much for taking the time. I appreciate it.
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